sam Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 2
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Reply with quote | #1 |
Anyone have any experience with using dogbane as a bowdrill string? Good choice, or would yucca do better? I have some dogbane I brought back with me from KS but as there isn't any to be had (that I know of) here in the NW, Im hesitant to use it up and yucca is fairly plentiful. Thanks. |
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dixieangler Registered: 06/11/09
Posts: 72
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Reply with quote | #2 | I have not used dogbane yet. According to the USDA, we don't have it here where I live in Florida.
http://plants.usda.gov/java/county?state_name=Florida&statefips=12&symbol=APOCY
I have been looking for the Heartleaf Nettle but the USDA shows we don't have that either.
http://plants.usda.gov/java/county?state_name=Florida&statefips=12&symbol=URCH3
I know we have the Wood Nettle because I have seen it but it is a hard one to find since it is not that common and not every brush thicket has it. LOL I will keep looking for all these kinds of nettle though anyway in case I happen to come across them.
I have used and still use Yucca leaf fibers for a doubled cord on the firebow and I can get a doubled Yucca cord any time of the year. I have lots of doubled Yucca cords for the firebow now and many are fairly old and still work. It is the only natural cord material so far I can say that for. I was hoping that finding a nettle would provide another year round cord material (but not sure if it is year round or seasonal). Be careful with barks because many are seasonal and will rot out of season, meaning that your once very strong (Cocklebur, Velvetleaf, etc.) doubled bark cord will break when it gets past its season. Best of luck.
__________________ Robert M. |
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dixieangler Registered: 06/11/09
Posts: 72
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Reply with quote | #3 | Okay. I found some Dogbane (probably a different variety than the common ones but I am sure that is what it is even though it has no leaves right now, not much around here can compare to it with those characteristic hanging seed pods) near a pond today and started using the bark. I will make three long single cords and then use them to make a doubled cord. The USDA says we don't have it but sometimes they are not always right. I think this one might be the same sort of thing as other barks though. It is super strong now but once it gets past its season it probably will rot and break but right now it is very strong so I will try using it and see how long it lasts. Maybe it will surprise me and last year round. LOL
Quote: Originally Posted by sam Good choice, or would yucca do better?
I would use the Dogbane now rather than later since it is a bark. Waiting later may mean that it will lose its current strength. But since you have Yucca in abundance, that will be a longer lasting choice I think. Again, best of luck with your cording.
BTW, did you know besides cordage from the leaves, spindles and boards from the dead and dry stem, that you can eat the Yucca blossoms? See the (Green) Deane Jordan links below.
Yucca Filamentosa Video #26 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_Y0T6xZJ-c&feature=channel_page
Yucca Filamentosa Article Yucca's Not Yucky http://www.eattheweeds.com/www.EatTheWeeds.Com/EatTheWeeds.com/Entries/1934/8/20_Yucca%E2%80%99s_Not_Yucky.html
__________________ Robert M. |
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dixieangler Registered: 06/11/09
Posts: 72
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Reply with quote | #4 | I now have one single cord and another half done before I ran out of Dogbane bark and had to go collect some more. Problem is that the stalks are not completely woody yet and I am not sure I can finish with three single cords. Still some green in them so I may have to wait a while before I can get some more woody bark. I did find some of the Dogbane that was very green with leaves and blooms still on them. Don't know if the green bark would work or not yet. Peterson's says the blooms should be whitish pale pink but the ones I am seeing are yellow so now I am not sure I have the right plant but it is Dogbane like from all other aspects. I have not cut into the green stems to see if the sap is milky white but the older stems have a white pith. Maybe the sap hardened to a pith as it goes woody? Oh well, this whatever it is bark makes a good strong single cord anyway. LOL I may have to take a sample down to the Ag Center county extension office and the master gardeners for a positive identificaion on it. I know Dogbane is poisonous but use for cordage is not that critical for knowing plant names because I am only looking for fiberous characteristics but plants for food is and I would definitely get a positive ID for any unfamiliar plant before I even thought about eating it. __________________ Robert M. |
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prariewolf Moderator
Registered: 11/28/06
Posts: 105
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Reply with quote | #5 | two ply cordage made from most natural materials will handle the stress of bow drill fire making. Some probably won't on a regular basis but I have not personally experienced those. others are more or less brittle than their neighbor - ie: dog bane is more silky and pliable and stronger than many where some/maybe most yucca and velvet leaf would be on the more brittle side of things.The cord is being asked a lot to take the repeated stress of bending repeatedly in a circle - plus the longitudinal stress placed on it. The brittle ones won't take as much as the more pliable. Dog bane is one of the strongest and more pliable fibers available. Yucca is very strong but more brittle. Velvet leaf (Buttonweed) is OK for strength but also brittle-ish. Hemp is a good standard - used forever as ropes, cords, bowstrings and more. Nettle has silky fibers such as the dog bane but from my experience (all this input is from my own experience) tho the fibers of nettle are very strong, I find that they rot easily. Get 'em fresh and keep 'em dry in storage and you should be OK. Milkweed - I have heard and seen reference to this as being a fine material but I CANNOT extract the fiber from it here in KS. (and have not tried it elsewhere). Maybe it's a local thing? - so I cannot give input here. I have used many fibers green to good avail in fire making - hemp, velvet leaf, yucca, basswood (real tree bark). Besides sometimes having too much moisture thereby causing slippage I have had success - sometimes better than when used dried. I base my success with how these work with the bow drill on the making of ONE fire only. I almost always use a new/different string from fire to fire as I don't want the hassle of losing the fire because of string breakage. In our video “Primitive Wilderness Skills, Applied” you see where we used the two strings we made for the fire separately and then corded together in 7-8 fire making attempts before we had success - green hemp. The chaff/bark was left on.
__________________ Prairiewolf.net |
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dixieangler Registered: 06/11/09
Posts: 72
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Reply with quote | #6 |
Quote: Originally Posted by prariewolf Yucca is very strong but more brittle.
Brittle for real? The only time I have had Yucca leaf cord break on me was when I got a kink or twist in it but then again I double my firebow cords. It lasts a long time for me compared to most barks as far as age goes.
Quote: Originally Posted by prariewolf Get 'em fresh and keep 'em dry in storage and you should be OK.
For how long? Most bark fibers I have gotten and stored dry, rot and turn brittle over time (past their season) even those I have corded and used when they were very strong.
Quote: Originally Posted by prariewolf dog bane is more silky and pliable and stronger than many Dog bane is one of the strongest and more pliable fibers available.
This Dogbane like plant I am working with now is just like that. Really strong, silky, and pliable.
Thanks for the tips on Nettle(tho the fibers of nettle are very strong, I find that they rot easily.), Hemp, and Milkweed. I haven't found any of those here yet except for Wood Nettle a long time ago. __________________ Robert M. |
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DirttimeDude Registered: 11/13/07
Posts: 32
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Reply with quote | #7 |
Yucca while still green , I find , works better... After it is dried it does get brittle. If you have some olive oil to rub into the fiber it helps a bit if it is really dry. Also if the yucca fiber is really dry, wet it, the fibers do not seem to break down as fast that way.
Dogbane here in SoCa is the really much better than the yucca.
In either case if you wrap the spindle more than once it takes a lot of the pressure and wear off the cordage.. It is a kind of a modified egyptian method that way.
Dude...check yer6
__________________ I have been where the hand of man has never set foot. |
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dixieangler Registered: 06/11/09
Posts: 72
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Reply with quote | #8 | That Dogbane like (probably not real Dogbane) doubled cord did not work very well on the firebow. First time it held up well. Second time it snapped even with the Egyptian method. For a doubled firebow bark cord, I will stick with Cocklebur. Otherwise in the off season or year round, I will use Yucca leaf fibers. __________________ Robert M. |
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